Death Threats on Ari Ne’eman

There are few people in the world who piss me off as much as “John Best”.  All in all, I think I’d rather go up against Voldemort in a rage than have to listen to the insane and hate filled drivel of John Best, the demented and psychotic man who writes a blog called “Hating Autism.”  I’ll let you look that one up, if you will.  I’m not linking him.

While he does have somewhat of a point in saying that Asperger’s and autism are not exactly the same thing, the validity of his statements ends there.  And for him to lever death threats against someone who has done far more good in this lifetime than anyone like Best, allows for even LESS credibility to be extracted from his statements on anything.

Asperger’s Syndrome and autism are not the same thing, but they are related, and often in more ways than one.  I can relate an example as to how I know this to be true.  For people experienced in the world of autism, they should know that autistic people on the lower functioning end of the scale often have episodes of self-harm or commit bodily injury against themselves, like throwing themselves into walls.

As for me, with my aspie status, I still have the desire to throw myself into walls, I just tend not to listen to it.  It is a partially a sensory thing and partially an emotional thing, which both lead to an uncontrollable bout of sensations that I, and I’m sure others like me, experience an overwhelming desire to just make stop, damn the costs.

Really, in a way, aspies are more like gatekeepers into the world of the autistic spectrum itself.

A great many would argue that we do not experience the same things and therefore do not have one inkling of understanding as to what it is like to be a lower functioning individual.

I beg to differ.  It’s true that while the severity of the sensations is often not the same, the sensations themselves are still felt.   I don’t think it’s a question of intelligence, but rather it’s levels of understanding and expressing that are different.

And let me say this, all of us, across the spectrum, we all know fear; we all know terror, and what it does to our lives.

And you, John Best, are no better than anyone, especially for thinking that you can just add to that fear that makes all of our lives harder to experience here in your fucking world.

So fuck off and leave the death threats where they belong – out of the conversation.

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~ by lastcrazyhorn on May 11, 2009.

28 Responses to “Death Threats on Ari Ne’eman”

  1. Well a fact is never a fact but merely an opinion shared.

    Autistic Disorder, is not the same as Autism.

    Autism is the metadescriptor, the class containing the classes.

    Spectrum, landscape, they are just additional descriptors, colour and icing.

    If you look at the world solely through the eyes of the psychiatric taxonomist you don’t see much at all.

    Arguments based around invalid constructions have no place in my opinion.

    Why use the Devil’s dictionary or the enemies language and descriptions.

    I do not fit neatly into anyones categories, because I am a particular locus where axes cross. I exist in Hilbert space 🙂

  2. […] threats against Ne'eman, Amanda Baggs, and other autistic self-advocates.  Other people have already said most of what I want to say, so I have a simple question. Imagine Best is the father of a […]

  3. Hi Lastcrazyhorn,
    Nice to meet you.
    I cure autism and Asperger’s. Ari Ne’eman does not. I can help you. Ari Ne’eman will not. If you like being disabled, listen to Ari. If you want a better life, I’ll be happy to share my knowledge with you and help you arrive there.

  4. Aspies are not even trying to speak for “low functioning” people, anyway. How would we know what they want any better than the neurotypicals do? How does anyone know what anyone else is thinking? I couldn’t “speak for” another Aspie with identical symptoms, so how would I expect to speak for someone whose experience of autism is completely different from mine?

    We don’t want to put words in anyone’s mouth; we want people to listen to those “low functioning” people when they speak for themselves, whether that’s words, signs, AAC, or just screaming when something’s wrong. And we want people to give them the same human rights anyone else has–the right to be treated with respect and educated in the way they learn, taught how to do things instead of having their learning stunted because people are trying to control their “behaviors” without understanding them, or trying to make them as “normal” as possible.

    There are an awful lot of “low functioning” autistic people who are essentially taught that the best way to get through life is to be quiet, don’t complain, and do what you’re told. (Lots of “high functioning” people, too.) They’re being told what they think and feel doesn’t matter if they don’t express it exactly the way typical people express it. That goes against everything we know about human rights, and it needs to stop. I don’t care how disabled you are; when you speak, people should listen.

  5. “We don’t want to put words in anyone’s mouth; we want people to listen to those “low functioning” people when they speak for themselves, whether that’s words, signs, AAC, or just screaming when something’s wrong. And we want people to give them the same human rights anyone else has–the right to be treated with respect and educated in the way they learn, taught how to do things instead of having their learning stunted because people are trying to control their “behaviors” without understanding them, or trying to make them as “normal” as possible.”

    Amen.

  6. I’ll just say that chaoticidealism expressed my views almost exactly.

  7. Larry Arnold incorrectly stated: “Autistic Disorder, is not the same as Autism. Autism is the metadescriptor, the class containing the classes.”

    The DSM-IV actually lists Autistic Disorder as one of five diagnoses in the PDD category, the Pervasive Developmental Disorders. It is only common usage that describes the PDD’s as Autism Spectrum Disorders.

    The class that contains the classes, to quote Larry Arnold, is the class of PDD’s, only one of which is expressly labeled as “autistic”, and that is the Autistic Disorder category.

  8. Harold as usual you are on a different planet, I am not discussing the validity of DSM as a system because it is not valid as a descriptor of the world, I am discussing the underlying concepts that govern the world in which DSM is an artefact.

    Autism as a descriptor, a class, existed before it was formulated into DSM, it was a concept that was adopted from another older nosology and exists because of the medical culture of the 1940’s built upon the work of the likes of Charcot, Bleuler, Alzheimer, Kraepelin et al.

    If you have time to discover how we got to the concept of autism I could recommend some reading.

    Incedentally DSM IV had to bow to the ICD system, even the US trade association of psychiatrists is not immune to international trends.

  9. Larry has it pretty much bang on. The concept of the autism spectrum came about because they are characterised by what used to be (and still is) referred to as ‘autistic thinking’ or ‘autistic behaviour’. The expansion of the criteria came about because people realised that there were people with ‘autism-like’ conditions who nevertheless could not be reasonably put into any other catagory, but who weren’t strict matches for autism as it was defined then.

    The delineation in the DSM exists for diagnostic and administrative purposes – it does not model an observed, real world delineation. It also only applys to medical systems that accept the DSM definition, which is mostly just the USA and Canada.

    The arguements against the use of the word ‘autism’ in references to aspergers is a legitimate one, but it has very weak power. Not only was the establishment of aspergers as a condition derived from the study of autism, but both conditions are very similar in terms of their diagnostic features. Although there are discussions going on as to wheter or not mainstream autism services (where they exist) may not be entirely suitable for people with aspergers, I’ve never heard of any autism organisation or service that does not consider them the same for all clinical and pragmatic purposes.

    If one were to equate having sickle cell aneamia to having diabeties simply because both involve the blood, then one would very much conflating two distinctly seperate conditions for very dubious reasons, and you would very well deserve to be ridiculed for you lack of knowledge and understanding of the conditions involved. They are simply too distinct to be reasonably put together.

    Criticising people for using the word ‘autism’ in reference to aspergers not only comes across as pedantic, but also quite needless, as the distinction (shorn of all performance skill profiles and needs assessments) is really only important to those trying to claim some sort of “I’m/my son/daughter/grandchild is a REAL autistic becuase some authourity said so, therefore my words are more legitimate than yours, even though I’m not the one that’s autistic”.

    This is even worse if the self same person is also a vaccine skeptic. They’ll happily accept the medical consesus on autism terminology, yet won’t accept the same consensus on vaccines, and then disallow you the same right to offer alternative interpretations.

    They are a mixed bag of odd fish indeed.

  10. Kanner and Asperger wrote at roughly the same time in different countries and different circumstances, think T4 and extermination and then think how careful Asperger had to be.

    If you seperate out the influencing factors on the way Kanner and Asperger wrote up there work, and also consider subtle differences between the US and Germanic education and culture, you will see there is not too much dissimilarity considering the small sample sizes of both original papers.

    The fact is both used the word Autism, which was a current term in psychiatry, and Asperger perhaps explained why he used the term in more detail than Kanner.

    If it were not for the circumstances of the war, things would be very different, and perhaps the German language would not have lost the lead it once had in the publication of scientific papers.

    After Kanner, the science became somewhat distorted by Bettelheim and then along came DSM, essentially just an attempt to rigorise for statistical purposes, diagnostic practice.

    Lorna Wing’s work along with Gillberg and Frith, revitalised the study of autism and showed it not to be so rare, indeed not so special or mysterious either.

    If anyone ever talks with Lorna Wing about it, and I have you will realise that she does not believe in the DSM version of things either, and in coining the term Asperger’s syndrome, she intended it as a tribute to Asperger’s forgotten work, not a diagnostic category.

    It was the politicing of DSM revision and research agenda’s which largely gave us the mish mash of poorly differentiated descriptors whose differences are more semantic than actually decipherable in research terms.

    Those who quibble over the terms tend to be those who have political agendas of there own, and generally bad science to back them up.

    You think Autism is confused, you should try Dyslexia for a muddle. Dyslexia however does not currently carry the same connotations and therefore the disputes do not reach the level of the hate messages we see in the Autism world. However it has it’s own biomedical quacks and curebies, one of whom Wynford Dore thinks he can cure Autism too.

  11. I may seem offhand with Harold, it is no more than he deserves. I do not deign to question his competance as a lawyer because it is something I know little of, but when it comes to autism, I think he should defer, instead of dismissing anything that comes out of the “high funtioning” autistic community.

    Harold’s engagement with autism is purely emotional, his understanding is emotional. He cannot see past his own subjective judgement as to what autism is or may be.

    For that one has to dump ones preconceptions. I would not be pursuing a doctorate if I were in anywise considered to be ignorant of the wider world of autism, something judged not on the knock about stage of the internet, but academically by acknowleged leaders in the field.

    I do not doubt that in a court of law I would have more right to call myself an expert than the schlock fringe performers dragged in by the mercurians with scant regard to either there expertise or there efficacy.

  12. Larry,
    Instead of wasting your time and money on a doctorate taught by simpletons, you should allow those of us who actually know something about autism to enlighten you. Your experience as an autistic person can only be appreciated properly by knowing life through undamaged brains. We’re here to help you, Larry.

    • John,

      You do not qualified then.My son’s have Asperger and their brain is different.They are only 7 but they are actually more intelligent then you

  13. What is really going on?

    There are a number of people in our world who do not feel that people on the spectrum have a right to basic civil rights.

    Ari is a fighter and he has been chosen by God to deal with discrimination and hate. Threats to a person with autism are not only disgraceful but ignorant. Courage, integrity and resolve live within you Ari, but that’s not all a gratitude of a mother warrior is with you too.

    When I think of Ari’s situation I think of a speech delivered by Dr. Martin Luther King, Jr., on April 4, 1967 quote: “A time comes when silence is betrayal.”

    No matter who you or your family are,if you are touched by autism in any form you can not allow death threats. A healthy debate never includes a threat. Do not fool yourself, this is far more serious than some may conclude.

    We all must stand up for the civil rights of our children, friends and family with autism.

    We may never cure hate, but to spread the disease is a mark on your forehead that far outweighs any good you may believe you are doing.

    Open your eyes to the world around you and see that this is clearly a war or rights.

    Please send reinforcements.

    Melissa Barton

  14. Melissa, Our kids have the right to not be poisoned by vaccines and they have the right to medical treatment to cure the autism. Ari wants to deny those rights. He is a sadist.

    • Funny, we get more mercury from the air we breathe due to coal-fired power plants than we do from vaccines. Additionally, most mercury has been removed from childhood vaccinations since 2003, but autism rates are still rising. Obviously, IF mercury is involved in autism, then it is not the vaccines that are currently the problem.
      I’m sorry your son is unable to communicate. Get creative. Put scratch-n-sniff stickers and Braille on your PECS, use tactile sign (sign for the Deaf-Blind), try tapping on his shoulder in Morse Code for crying out loud. He may or may not be mentally retared under all the sensory integration dysfunction, but as the person with the better-developed nervous system, it IS your job to find out what sensory modes are open in him and use those in your efforts to communicate. I do this with clients of mine and have teenagers who can communicate for the first time ever, some of whom do still smear feces on the wall (it seems to be a sensory issue) and throw tantrums.
      We call it an Autism Spectrum because these artificial distincitons created by the DSM-IV serve no one except professionals, and sadistic people like you who pepper us with death threats. Like a rainbow, it is hard to tell red from orange, but easy to distinguish either from blue. But all are on a continuum, and all are colours. The Autism Spectrum is similar. It is impossible to tell the difference between a person with Aspgerger’s Syndrome and a person with sufficiently High-Functioning Autism without looking through their developmental records and finding out who was speech delayed and who was not.
      Mr. Best, stop spreading hatred around. We’re tired of your bigotry, and we’re not willing to stand for it any more.

  15. Just wanted to say that non-autistics also have the desire to throw themselves into walls on occasion. Other than that, agree wholeheartedly with lastcrazyhorn.

  16. Comments to the mercury/vaccine alarmists: Here’s #1-4 things to do to avoid mercury poisoning: Don’t eat clams or lobsters, and if it ever comes up, don’t eat a whale or a polar bear. There is likely to be more mercury in any of these than in a hundred thimerosal vaccines.

    Also, if thimerosal caused autism, increases should have started around the time thimerosal was invented: 1928.

    Finally, if they are correct in ascribing autism to mercury poisoning, then it is no less incurable than a genetic disorder. For existing tissue damage, removing mercury by chelation won’t do any more good than removing the bullet does for a gunshot wound.

  17. A contemplative piece of some real merit. There is real experiential consonence here, and no little disclosure

  18. John Best displays the typical characteristics of a quack. He believes that there is a conspiracy behind autism for profits by pharmacudical companies, he says that he can cure autistics and that anyone who disagrees with him is pure evil and works for some pharmacudical company. That’s the problem in society; snake oil salespersons.

  19. Alexinas,
    Some people disagree with me who have good intentions. They could also be right.
    The Neuroinsane do not have good intentions and every word they say is a well thought out lie.

    • What bad intentions do they have?

      Wait, I already know. They don’t. You’re just saying so because they threaten your revenue because they propose that parents should accept their children because they are not taken and they will never be cured.
      People like you tend to do more damage than good. Let me guess, neurodiversity is pharmacudical propaganda.

  20. Re: a blog called “Hating Autism.” I’ll let you look that one up, if you will. I’m not linking him.

    I never got to the message, the language manner of presentation turned me off at the start.

  21. Neurodiversity? I don’t see it in the Ari Ne’eman crowd. At least not until they openly acknowledge people like my son and stop pretending autistic persons like him, don’t exist. My videos on you tube of my severely autistic son who suffers from self injurious behaviors have been obsessively attacked by some in the neurodiversity movement. Like children having a tantrum, they repeatedly give thumbs down to anyone who applauds me for showing real sides of real severe autism. This is very telling. This shows these alleged advocates for autism are probably not autistic. Consider Rain Man, could U imagine this sweet guy (based on real life person) trolling you tube and attacking a mother like me who has been through hell trying to help my son? It wouldn’t even occur to him, or even Temple Grandin, who has severe Aspergers, to act like or do this. But so called “auties” and “aspies” who hate my guts now, are on a rampage to villify me and downplay my son’s condition because it threatens to expose their narrow driven movement that FAILS or willfully ignores autistic peole like my darling son. Please go to you tube and see the video “autism epidemic out of control.” Many of my friends and family members are helping me spread word about this because it is really scary that such hate, intolerance and outright mean spirited attacks would come against me and my son or anyone else who is dealing with serious issues like self injury. We just want to be included. Why such prejudice against us from the neodiversity crowd? Why such hate? Mockery? It is simply unreal that these neurodiversity fanatics are even posting things on “wrong planet” (a good site) like “the mother must feel guilty” or she’s got munchasen by proxy, or “she’s whacked.” This is often funny to me, actually, as I gather their comments and really look at the kind of spirit they have. It is not one of helping people like my son. It is not empathetic. Nor considerate. Nor of love. They are driven by a spirit of self-preservation. They have an agenda. They’ve fooled a lot of people. And cases like my son are driving them crazy. So, they want to shred us. Shut me up. It won’t work. In fact, it will work against them. Some, however, in the neurodiversity movement are really kind, honest and open minded people who have Aspergers and actually acknowledge my son’s severe autism and support us, and for that I am grateful. I wish they could all be so honest and kind. I have a close relative with Aspergers and he in no way would ever downplay my son’s autism or attack it because it made him look bad. Is it too much to ask that my son’s severe autism self injury and seizure challenges are discussed in neurodiversity circles? Why such prejudice against his type of autism? Why downplay it as it he isn’t part of neurodiversity? I think my son’s case baffles and infuriates some neurodiversity folks because when you see him slamming his fists into his head, clearly, this isn’t an autistic person you’d say “to just accept as he is.” Well, the truth is, I accept my son’s autism. But that doesn’t remove the fact that his self injurious behaviors, which are deeply rooted in the autism, can be ignored or ‘celebrated’. This is serious stuff and for a neurodiversity movement to willfully ignore this autsitic population is unethical and shows extreme prejudice. Severe to profound autism is real and must be acknowledged if you claim to really care about autism advocacy. I’m not the type of mom who blames vaccines, by the way. I’m probably baffling to the neurodiversity movement because I share some of their beliefs, but I also am very vocal about how serious self injury is within the more severe sides of autism. They just can’t figure me out. So, sadly, some attack me.

    • No offense, but they likely “attack” you simply because your writing style is completely unclear. I mean, saying that you don’t like neurodiversity people, yet going on to say that, well yes, you do like some of them . . . I mean, pick one and stick with it.

      Paragraphs are very in right now as well.

      I’m not making fun of you, I’m just offering a few tips as how to be better received. If I was more paranoid, and you had used direct links, I would have thought that you were spamming me in favor of youtube.

  22. None of us denies that those with severe autism have a severe disability and need assistance. However, the fact is that there are people alive who had all the characteristics of severe autism when we were small children, or even older children, who have grown into adults who appear more Asperger’s. The fact also remains that, like the Deaf, we have chosen to claim our label of Autistic and be proud of who we are.
    Temple Grandin does NOT have severe Asperger’s, and never has been diagnosed as such. She is High Functioning Autistic. Denial of our true labels only makes you look like ignorant deniers, just like the fools who try to deny that the Holocaust was an historical event.

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